Talk:Deir Yassin massacre

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May 19, 2005	Articles for deletion	Kept
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Casualties have been reported as 240 Palestinians killed

"The Assassignation of James Forrestal" second addition by David Martin 181.73.83.103 (talk) 14:08, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes this is mentioned in the article in the casualties section. That is an estimate which was widely believed in the past but estimates today are closer to 100. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 14:27, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Why is eliezer tauber's book not cited?

I saw the discussions in the archive. However, none of them mentioned how this book has been praised by respectable historians for the data collection and had respectable historians (such as [[Benny Morris]]) participating in the data collection. Those who praised Tauber for the data collection do not agree with his conclusions. Nevertheless, we can draw information from the book despite its controversial conclusion, given that the data (specifically, names and causes of death) is generally not considered inaccurate Someonefighter (talk) 20:25, 9 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Source/examples to support that it was/is "praised by respectable historians"? IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 23:30, 9 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

gadi 7itman https://campuscore.ariel.ac.il/wp/jimes/wp-content/uploads/sites/147/2019/01/Jimes-Vol1_GadiHitman_2017-11-16.pdf pages 57-59

3ude bashrat (israeli arab historian) https://www.haaretz.co.il/literature/study/2017-11-29/ty-article-review/.premium/0000017f-dbf6-d3ff-a7ff-fbf6e7750000 Someonefighter (talk) 23:49, 9 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

English sources are preferrable. I don't speak Hebrew. IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 00:08, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

these works and articles don't appear to have been translated to english. additional sources would require extensive research by me. could you get away with machiene translation? Someonefighter (talk) 00:16, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

If "extensive research" is required to find positive reviews of Tauber's work, wouldn't that suggest it is rather fringe and/or undue to cite here? IOHANNVSVERVS (talk) 00:28, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

no, actually. I just overestimated the time. a quick google search finds this https://campuscore.ariel.ac.il/wp/jimes/wp-content/uploads/sites/147/2025/01/04-JIMES-10-2-Rinehart-Review.pdf Someonefighter (talk) 05:44, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

heres another one https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/eliezer-tauber-massacre-never-myth-deir-yassin-creation-alex-grobman (writer is an American historian) Someonefighter (talk) 06:49, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Here's how the second article begins (translation agreed by two different machine translators):

"Deir Yassin: The End of the Myth": A Book Suggesting Ben-Gurion Was Responsible for the 1948 Massacre
In the narrative presented by Eliezer Tauber in his book on the massacre in Deir Yassin, there are so many errors, misunderstandings, and such an excessive desire to avoid harm to civilians, that the reader ultimately feels compelled to scold the village residents who were murdered and thus tarnished the reputation of the Irgun and Lehi fighters.

The author's thesis in this piece is that the attack was a Haganah operation probably supported by Ben-Gurion, and that the Irgun/Lehi attackers were essentially engaged to do the dirty work. Zero^talk 03:21, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]

later in the article:

ספרו של טאובר גדוש בעובדות, שנטוו בסדר כרונולוגי מרשים, והן חשובות ביותר לכל מי שמתעניין במה שהתרחש בדיר יאסין באותו יום נורא. למרות כוונותיו של הכותב לטהר את שמם של הפורשים, זה ספר זורם שנצמד לעובדות. זה סוד כוחו וסוד משיכתו, ומנגד גם סוד חולשתו — שכן אין בו ההקשר הכללי. איני מתכוון לערער על העובדות המובאות בספר, אך על בסיס אותן עובדות מצאתי נרטיב אחר מזה של טאובר לאירועים.

Translation (agreed upon by multiple machine translations): Tauber’s book is packed with facts, woven together in an impressive chronological order, and they are extremely important for anyone interested in what happened in Deir Yassin on that dreadful day. Despite the author’s intentions to clear the names of the Irgun and Lehi fighters, it’s a compelling book that sticks to the facts. That’s the source of its power and appeal — but also the source of its weakness, as it lacks broader context. I don’t intend to dispute the facts presented in the book, but based on those same facts, I arrived at a different narrative than Tauber’s regarding the events.

Someonefighter (talk) 06:00, 10 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]